I have had sources I used not accepted by Wikipedia and imagine that such oversight could be construed by some that Wikipedia is controlled. And I have been refused an edit because another editor just plain didn't like my point of view. For example, take a look at the talk page below when I tried to add information about Ian Fleming as founder of the journal, the Book Collector. (WHICH HE WAS!) I was refused a citation to “The Agent’s Secret.” TLS. Times Literary Supplement (1969), no. 5946 (2017): 36. I tried and tried but was denied by HAL333.
Below is the "talk" where the othe editor kept telling me I couldn't use the Book COLLECTOR as a primary source. Even thought I was writing about Fleming's actual work somehow this wasn't liked by one of the page's editors. Was it the fact that the bibliophile aspect of Ian Fleming's life impaired the other editors' desire to portray Fleming as otherwise? I was then accused of not understanding Wikipedia because the other editor decided I didn't understand it. (tricky way to make another editor step back).
I think this was harsh treatment of my efforts.
==
Fleming as Book Collector
I added a citation to an article about Fleming as a book collector. It was removed with no reason. He founded the journal, The Book Collector. Listen to The Book Collector's first podcast! Percy Muir's article 'Ian Fleming: A Personal Memoir' from the Spring 1965 issue, read by Rupert Vansittart.
The Fleming collection at Indiana University isn't even mentioned on this page. I think this is a major omission.Kmccook (talk) 19:48, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
I added a section about this under "Legacy."Kmccook (talk) 20:04, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
Him being a book collecter is not worthy of first sentence inclusion. That's undue weight. But I'm not opposed to it - or the IU collection - being included in the article. How much do literary sources such as his biographies discuss this aspect of his life? ~ HAL333 20:17, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
The section I added about Fleming's book collecting has been deleted and I've been accused of "sock puppetry." I am baffled why adding well documented facts about the book collecting of Fleming has been deleted and why I am locked out of editing. I wrote a substack entry, "Ian Fleming & Wikipedia" about it since no one deleting my additions will respond. I used the image of his special book plate.Kmccook (talk) 03:34, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
Your block log is clear and I can not find anyone accusing you of sock puppetry. Am I missing something? ~ HAL333 03:58, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
Below is what I see when I tried to add about the book collection:
09:29, 5 March 2021 Wugapodes talk contribs protected Ian Fleming [Edit=Require autoconfirmed or confirmed access] (indefinite) [Move=Require autoconfirmed or confirmed access] (indefinite) (Persistent sock puppetry) (hist) (thank)
I don't understand. I had written a piece about the Lilly Library collection and had some citations and I thought that a bit about Fleming's book collector activities would be a good add to the page. I wasn't controversial or w/o documentation. Does someone think that Fleming's book collection hurts his image? It enhances it to me.Kmccook (talk) 04:24, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
I added a paragraph with citations and got this: 20:03, 17 July 2021 diff hist +772 Ian Fleming →Legacy: added information about Fleming as founder of The Book Collector and the collection at Indiana University Library. Tag: Reverted. It doesn't say why. Someone just decided that documentation about Fleming's book collecting was unacceptable. Why?Kmccook (talk) 04:41, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
The Book Collector is a primary source. Do you have a reliable secondary source that could support this content? ~ HAL333 14:42, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
I feel as if I am on trial. I am not trying to do something nefarious here. The Book Collector's interview with people who worked with Fleming would be the secondary source. Here is a brief note from 1969 in the Times Literary Suplement:
“The Agent’s Secret.” TLS. Times Literary Supplement (1969), no. 5946 (2017): 36–.
Here is the website of Indiana University Lilly Library's 2018 Exhibit: Ian Fleming: From Bibliophile to Bond The Ian Fleming website has a page about this: Ian Fleming: Book Collector.Kmccook (talk) 15:41, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
No one is persecuting you... This is a Featured-class article and you keep adding primary sources and disregarding the BOLD, revert, discuss cycle. I find it hard to believe that you don't understand the basic workings of Wikipedia. You've been editing since 2007. And no, The Book Collector, even if includes interviews of third persons, will never be a secondary source when it is used to source information about itself. I've added a single sentence, which is due, about the IU Fleming collection. Could you provide a url for The Time Literary Supplement? ~ HAL333
How can this be a first class article if it ignores something to which Fleming devoted so much time? You most certainly are throwing chaff at my simple attempt to add information. I understand that Wikipedia does not like women editors. I do not know why. You may have decided that women have no right to edit the Fleming article or that identifying Fleming as the founder of The Book Collector hurts his image. But he was. The URL for the TLS article is here: https://www.the-tls.co.uk/articles/the-agents-secret/
I led with the TLS citation and put it back in the article under "the 1950s" when Fleming took over the journal. You can delete it if you wish. I won't try anymore. Very discouraged. Kmccook (talk) 16:31, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
I see the citation to “The Agent’s Secret.” TLS. Times Literary Supplement (1969), no. 5946 (2017): 36. was deleted/ Reverted. Congratulations, HAL.Kmccook (talk) 20:31, 18 July 2021
I have had sources I used not accepted by Wikipedia and imagine that such oversight could be construed by some that Wikipedia is controlled. And I have been refused an edit because another editor just plain didn't like my point of view. For example, take a look at the talk page below when I tried to add information about Ian Fleming as founder of the journal, the Book Collector. (WHICH HE WAS!) I was refused a citation to “The Agent’s Secret.” TLS. Times Literary Supplement (1969), no. 5946 (2017): 36. I tried and tried but was denied by HAL333.
Below is the "talk" where the othe editor kept telling me I couldn't use the Book COLLECTOR as a primary source. Even thought I was writing about Fleming's actual work somehow this wasn't liked by one of the page's editors. Was it the fact that the bibliophile aspect of Ian Fleming's life impaired the other editors' desire to portray Fleming as otherwise? I was then accused of not understanding Wikipedia because the other editor decided I didn't understand it. (tricky way to make another editor step back).
I think this was harsh treatment of my efforts.
==
Fleming as Book Collector
I added a citation to an article about Fleming as a book collector. It was removed with no reason. He founded the journal, The Book Collector. Listen to The Book Collector's first podcast! Percy Muir's article 'Ian Fleming: A Personal Memoir' from the Spring 1965 issue, read by Rupert Vansittart.
The Fleming collection at Indiana University isn't even mentioned on this page. I think this is a major omission.Kmccook (talk) 19:48, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
I added a section about this under "Legacy."Kmccook (talk) 20:04, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
Him being a book collecter is not worthy of first sentence inclusion. That's undue weight. But I'm not opposed to it - or the IU collection - being included in the article. How much do literary sources such as his biographies discuss this aspect of his life? ~ HAL333 20:17, 17 July 2021 (UTC)
The section I added about Fleming's book collecting has been deleted and I've been accused of "sock puppetry." I am baffled why adding well documented facts about the book collecting of Fleming has been deleted and why I am locked out of editing. I wrote a substack entry, "Ian Fleming & Wikipedia" about it since no one deleting my additions will respond. I used the image of his special book plate.Kmccook (talk) 03:34, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
Your block log is clear and I can not find anyone accusing you of sock puppetry. Am I missing something? ~ HAL333 03:58, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
Below is what I see when I tried to add about the book collection:
09:29, 5 March 2021 Wugapodes talk contribs protected Ian Fleming [Edit=Require autoconfirmed or confirmed access] (indefinite) [Move=Require autoconfirmed or confirmed access] (indefinite) (Persistent sock puppetry) (hist) (thank)
I don't understand. I had written a piece about the Lilly Library collection and had some citations and I thought that a bit about Fleming's book collector activities would be a good add to the page. I wasn't controversial or w/o documentation. Does someone think that Fleming's book collection hurts his image? It enhances it to me.Kmccook (talk) 04:24, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
I added a paragraph with citations and got this: 20:03, 17 July 2021 diff hist +772 Ian Fleming →Legacy: added information about Fleming as founder of The Book Collector and the collection at Indiana University Library. Tag: Reverted. It doesn't say why. Someone just decided that documentation about Fleming's book collecting was unacceptable. Why?Kmccook (talk) 04:41, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
The Book Collector is a primary source. Do you have a reliable secondary source that could support this content? ~ HAL333 14:42, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
I feel as if I am on trial. I am not trying to do something nefarious here. The Book Collector's interview with people who worked with Fleming would be the secondary source. Here is a brief note from 1969 in the Times Literary Suplement:
“The Agent’s Secret.” TLS. Times Literary Supplement (1969), no. 5946 (2017): 36–.
Here is the website of Indiana University Lilly Library's 2018 Exhibit: Ian Fleming: From Bibliophile to Bond The Ian Fleming website has a page about this: Ian Fleming: Book Collector.Kmccook (talk) 15:41, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
No one is persecuting you... This is a Featured-class article and you keep adding primary sources and disregarding the BOLD, revert, discuss cycle. I find it hard to believe that you don't understand the basic workings of Wikipedia. You've been editing since 2007. And no, The Book Collector, even if includes interviews of third persons, will never be a secondary source when it is used to source information about itself. I've added a single sentence, which is due, about the IU Fleming collection. Could you provide a url for The Time Literary Supplement? ~ HAL333
How can this be a first class article if it ignores something to which Fleming devoted so much time? You most certainly are throwing chaff at my simple attempt to add information. I understand that Wikipedia does not like women editors. I do not know why. You may have decided that women have no right to edit the Fleming article or that identifying Fleming as the founder of The Book Collector hurts his image. But he was. The URL for the TLS article is here: https://www.the-tls.co.uk/articles/the-agents-secret/
I led with the TLS citation and put it back in the article under "the 1950s" when Fleming took over the journal. You can delete it if you wish. I won't try anymore. Very discouraged. Kmccook (talk) 16:31, 18 July 2021 (UTC)
I see the citation to “The Agent’s Secret.” TLS. Times Literary Supplement (1969), no. 5946 (2017): 36. was deleted/ Reverted. Congratulations, HAL.Kmccook (talk) 20:31, 18 July 2021
(UTC)).https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Ian_Fleming